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Supreme Being
Group: Forum Members
Last Login: Tuesday, September 02, 2008 2:46 PM
Posts: 88, Visits: 211 |
| When you do get this thing running, promise to stand up and tell us what it was. We might rib ya a bit, but we all have our stories too.
Anyhow, you have blue spark to the plugs, fuel to the carb, and compression. It gives off occasional backfires in the exhaust. You clearly have spark and fuel in the cylinders. It sounded consistent, so I'll ASSUME the firing order is correct. We need more info.
Give some answers:
1. Have you checked TDC marks with #1 piston?
2. Checked if #1 valves are closed at TDC?
3. Checked if the rotor points to #1 plug at TDC?
4. Do you have a timing light?
Use a hand mirror and a leather glove to look into the carb and check for flooding while cranking - keep your head far away! If it's flooding out and you have rubber lines, clamp the fuel line. It should keep your fuel level down in the carb.
notes:
*1,2-Pull #1 plug, and put a long straw in the hole while turning the motor by hand. When the straw is at it's highest, that is either TDC on the compression or exhaust stroke. Remove the valve cover and see if both the #1 rockers are loose (valves shut). If they are, it is the compression stroke TDC - if not, turn the motor one revolution and check again. CHECK DAMPER TIMING MARKS: When both valves are shut and piston is at high point, make sure the TDC timing mark is on pointer. If not, mark that point on the damper and report back. If the #1 valves are not closed at either TDC, ***STOP*** and report this to us. Indicates your timing chain is off.
*3-Pull distributor cap and see that the rotor is point toward the #1 plug while the piston is at TDC compression stroke. If not, put the #1 wire where the rotor faces and replace the other wires from that starting point.
*4-You have to have a timing light to check timing!!!!! Hook it on #1 plug wire next to the plug and check if it flashes near the damper marks when cranking. If it is nowhere near the TDC mark, there is still a timing problem - report back.
DO NOT ASSUME ANYTHING (And I will try to do the same!)
With the original mis-wired backfiring into the carb, the carb could be damaged or the timing chain could have jumped.
Patients, persistence, time .... and a little cash. |
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| | | Supreme Being
Group: Forum Members
Last Login: Sunday, August 17, 2008 7:40 AM
Posts: 75, Visits: 204 |
| okay today, we checked EVERYTHING.
i bought a new rotor
new condensor
new points
the distributor cap is new
all of the spark plug wires are giving off a spark
there is fuel getting to the carb
the coil is fine
WE HAVE THE TIMING RIGHT
we HAVE THE FIRING ORDER RIGHT
it is NOT 180 degrees out
we tried rotating it
we used starting fluid to help make it start and nothing happened
my dad stuck his thumb in the number 1 spark plug hole and there is compression
we have it all. it still will not start, wtf 
IT LIVES!
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| | | Supreme Being
Group: Forum Members
Last Login: Monday, September 01, 2008 9:08 PM
Posts: 124, Visits: 296 |
| Well you have sure worked hard and thrown enough new parts that it should start right up and run like a champ. But since it won`t start and you want it too we are missing something. I noticed this part "my dad stuck his thumb in the number 1 spark plug hole and there is compression" and that is a problem for me. In order to start you need a minimun amount and I do do not know what that is but around 100PSI seems right to me. Get ahold of a compression gauge and get a REAL NUMBER and post it. Wishing won`t do it. I had a 350 Chevy I rebuilt and could not start and it was low compression because I screwed up the valve settings. Who knew? Stop wasting money buying parts at random and do one thing at a time. You got spark, fine STOP working on the ignition. Fuel is squirting into the manifold fromthe carb? YES/NO if yes STOP working on the fuel system. What is left is timing and compression. With starting fuel and ignition you will GET SOMETHING to fire/backfire/afterfire or catch on fire and you don`t. CHECK THE COMPRESSION.
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| | | Supreme Being
Group: Forum Members
Last Login: Sunday, August 17, 2008 7:40 AM
Posts: 75, Visits: 204 |
| Pete 55Tbird (5/3/2008)
Well you have sure worked hard and thrown enough new parts that it should start right up and run like a champ. But since it won`t start and you want it too we are missing something. I noticed this part "my dad stuck his thumb in the number 1 spark plug hole and there is compression" and that is a problem for me. In order to start you need a minimun amount and I do do not know what that is but around 100PSI seems right to me. Get ahold of a compression gauge and get a REAL NUMBER and post it. Wishing won`t do it. I had a 350 Chevy I rebuilt and could not start and it was low compression because I screwed up the valve settings. Who knew? Stop wasting money buying parts at random and do one thing at a time. You got spark, fine STOP working on the ignition. Fuel is squirting into the manifold fromthe carb? YES/NO if yes STOP working on the fuel system. What is left is timing and compression. With starting fuel and ignition you will GET SOMETHING to fire/backfire/afterfire or catch on fire and you don`t. CHECK THE COMPRESSION.
thanks for the reply. you are right and i told my dad this to, that we need a real number, not just "yea we're getting compression", and my uncle has one of those compression gauges so if we can get a hold of it we'll test it.
now keep in mind im not smart..... my dad would know this so i'll ask it, but what kind of compression readings should we be getting from each cylinder?
and why is compression crucial to get an engine started? just courious because i dont know :-/
IT LIVES!
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| | | Supreme Being
Group: Forum Members
Last Login: Today @ 2:06 AM
Posts: 130, Visits: 725 |
| Most engines will run fine at ~75psi
compression gauge can be had at Harbor freight for less then 20 dollars
When I first trying to start my freshly rebuild engine, i had the same problem, I thought i have every thing right, all the stuff looks like its lined up (the rotor pointed at #1 timing mark @tdc), so I just move the dist either direction till i get it to start and then some more till it idles good, and i learned quickly that the timing mark on a 50 yr old damper held on by a rubber ring don't mean #!%#, so i use a piston stop, turn the crank in 1 direction, mark the pulley (i have the 57 1 piece pulley with a damper ring attached type, timing mark on damper ring.) and turn the other direction then mark gain, after that I make a permanent mark in the mid point of those 2 marks for the exact TDC of #1. runs like a champ, with accurate timing indicator.
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| | | Forum Member
Group: Forum Members
Last Login: Thursday, September 04, 2008 7:57 AM
Posts: 31, Visits: 121 |
| i had everything checked out also on start up.
ended up having to recharge the battery!
some spark may not be enough spark.
sounds like fuel system is fine.
i'd go back and check ignition/timing and battery.
probably a secondary circuit issue.
This ain't no L-Kamino! |
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| | | Supreme Being
Group: Forum Members
Last Login: Sunday, August 17, 2008 7:40 AM
Posts: 75, Visits: 204 |
| i showed my dad the last 2 posts in this thread and he said he doenst know what a secondary circuit is, or a piston stop? can anyone clarify maybe?
IT LIVES!
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Supreme Being
Group: Forum Members
Last Login: Tuesday, September 02, 2008 2:46 PM
Posts: 88, Visits: 211 |
| Piston Stop: Basically a bolt that screws into the plug hole of the #1 cylinder used to find TDC. Turn the motor as close to TDC as you can. Screw in the Piston Stop. Rotate the motor BY HAND until the piston hits the stop. Mark the damper. Turn the motor the opposite direction until it hits the stop. Mark the damper. Halfway in between the two marks is TDC. Since the dampers on Y-blocks can shift, this is really the only way to definitely find TDC.
Patients, persistence, time .... and a little cash. |
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